Over-flowing Head Problem....

The Main Sand Box for bertram31.com

Moderators: CaptPatrick, mike ohlstein, Bruce

Post Reply
matlos
Posts: 14
Joined: Jan 25th, '16, 08:15

Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by matlos »

I have a '63 b31 SF which has the head in the cabin between the berths. I recently installed a new electric head, and plumbing. While at rest, the water level in the bowl slowly rises and dribbles over the edge of the bowl.... It just drips, so its not necessarily dangerous, and I just open and close the valves every time I want to use it.... not very practical. Ideally, it needs a vent tube on the inlet and outlet pipes, because while the head is not actually below sea level it is very close and creates a siphon. There is however no room for making the required loop. Would a non-return valve work on the outlet pipe? Any other simple fixes that would not include an electric solenoid valve?

Should be a simple fix, but need to get it right.

Thanks,

Mat
B31 SF 1963 Greece
Tony Meola
Senior Member
Posts: 6940
Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
Contact:

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Tony Meola »

I have a very small back flow into mine, I installed a flapper check valve and it solved my problem.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
User avatar
Pete Fallon
Senior Member
Posts: 1313
Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 23:10
Location: Stuart Fl. and Salem, Ma.

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Pete Fallon »

Matlos,
How about running your discharge line up the back side of the head compartment into the anchor locker area, then add a vented loop, there should be enough room to keep the line from interfering with your anchor chain or line. If not add a check valve in the line like Tony suggested.
Pete Fallon
1961 Express Vizcaya Hull 186 12-13-61
matlos
Posts: 14
Joined: Jan 25th, '16, 08:15

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by matlos »

Tony hi,
I read that the check valves can get clogged and may not be the best option... have you experienced anything similar?

Pete, thanks for you suggestion. May be worth checking.

Mat
B31 SF 1963 Greece
Yannis
Senior Member
Posts: 3002
Joined: Oct 23rd, '13, 09:41
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Yannis »

matlos wrote:the check valves can get clogged and may not be the best option
...especially with what they have to let go through in your boat. Poor valve !!
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
Tony Meola
Senior Member
Posts: 6940
Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
Contact:

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Tony Meola »

It is a flapper type of check valve. The link below is the one I have used. I have not had a clog problem. But then again, we are careful as to what goes in the head. Also, I use the paper that is quick disolving.

http://www.westmarine.com/buy/bosworth- ... 32_003_515

http://www.westmarine.com/buy/west-mari ... --11012663

My valve is right at the bulkhead as it passes through to go to the holding tank. I also have the vented loop. My issue is the holding tank is outside of the starboard engine so it has a slight rise to it. I was getting some back flow from the vented loop to the toilet. Not enough to overflow the toilet but enough to make it a pain.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
Navatech

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Navatech »

"Marine toilet tissue" is a scam... Buy some 4 roll packs (or smaller if you can) at your local super market... Put a couple of sheets of each into a glass jar with water... Remember what you put in each glass... Purchase the one that "dissolved" in 1 hours or less as your "marine toilet tissue"... Cheaper toilet paper seems to be more dissolvable...
Yannis
Senior Member
Posts: 3002
Joined: Oct 23rd, '13, 09:41
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Yannis »

Nav,

This is a delicate issue. I just ONCE threw tp in the head, just to test what would happen. For days, there were still tiny pieces of paper coming out...

I suspect ALL tp has plastic in it, therefore very difficult to dissolve. In the islands, for example, in those remote houses that are not connected to a city sewage system and instead have a septic-absorbing tank, they tell people NOT to throw pt in the toilet, simply because it never dissolves and just clogs the tank's absorbing surface.

If there were a truly marine tp, I would like to know.
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
Navatech

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Navatech »

Yannis wrote:If there were a truly marine tp, I would like to know.
All paper is made out of fibers... Some paper has a binding agent to bind the fibers to each other... Some paper is actually laminated (glossy magazines)... What you want from "marine" TP is that it will dissolve into its constituent fibers... And that it will do so fast... Have you ever noticed the TP airlines use?!... Same thing...

Running a test like I described is easy and definitive... Once you have found a brand that dissolves you shouldn't have any problems...

Many RV and boat people do NOT flush TP... They have a garbage can or something along such lines in their WC... One guy I know doesn't carry ANY TP... He uses baby wipes and deposits them in sandwich bags...

Actually, TP isn't that common world wide... People all over the world wash their private parts with water to clean up... I wouldn't be surprised if they're the majority...

Do what you feel is right for you...
Yannis
Senior Member
Posts: 3002
Joined: Oct 23rd, '13, 09:41
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Yannis »

Navatech wrote:One guy I know doesn't carry ANY TP
That's me. You cannot block my head, simply because you will never find tp on my boat.
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
matlos
Posts: 14
Joined: Jan 25th, '16, 08:15

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by matlos »

Tony hi again,

Ok, so you have an enclosed head, with loop, going to the holding tank, and check valve from the holding tank back to the head... slightly different. Mine is between the fwd berths. So the only way to form the loop is probably in the chain locker.... I will go for the flap/check valve, it's easier at the moment.

Yianni, thanks for your useful insight.

Thanks,

Mat
B31 SF 1963 Greece
Navatech

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Navatech »

Yannis wrote:That's me. You cannot block my head, simply because you will never find tp on my boat.
So, sorry for the question but, how do you wipe your ass?!... And, what about those nice ladies you ferry around?!...
Yannis
Senior Member
Posts: 3002
Joined: Oct 23rd, '13, 09:41
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Yannis »

Nav,

We take a shower. Alternatively, the sea is always a good friend!
We very seldom have to use the boat facilities anyway...
Last edited by Yannis on Feb 7th, '16, 00:39, edited 1 time in total.
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
Tony Meola
Senior Member
Posts: 6940
Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
Contact:

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Tony Meola »

Yannis & Nav

Too much information.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
Yannis
Senior Member
Posts: 3002
Joined: Oct 23rd, '13, 09:41
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Yannis »

Sorry Tony, I just answered as briefly as possible.
On second thoughts, I edited to the minimum.
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
Tony Meola
Senior Member
Posts: 6940
Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
Contact:

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Tony Meola »

Yannis

Actually it is a saying here in the US when the info is getting maybe too personal or maybe the visual is lets say better left unknown.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
User avatar
JP Dalik
Senior Member
Posts: 1317
Joined: Jun 30th, '06, 21:03
Location: Pt. Pleasant NJ
Contact:

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by JP Dalik »

Is the bowl below the water line with no siphon break above the water line
KR


JP
1977 RLDT "CHIMERA"
matlos
Posts: 14
Joined: Jan 25th, '16, 08:15

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by matlos »

The top of the bowl is at the waterline... Piping is below waterline. There is no siphon, and there is not much room for one unless I pass it into the chain locker like pete suggested in a previous post, but that's not going to be easy. Let me know if you have any good ideas!
B31 SF 1963 Greece
matlos
Posts: 14
Joined: Jan 25th, '16, 08:15

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by matlos »

Image

The link should show a pic I think....
B31 SF 1963 Greece
Yannis
Senior Member
Posts: 3002
Joined: Oct 23rd, '13, 09:41
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Yannis »

Matt,

if you pass it into the chain locker you have to see what will be happening to the chain drain water and whether the chain weight might squeeze the tube loop.

Alternatively, you may consider passing the siphon loop up at the forward most end of the bed, up against the trapezoidal part in fiberglass, and bring the wooden part of the bulkhead by a few centimeters back and all the way down to cover it. This will inevitably render your bed a little shorter and you will have to also increase the height of the fiberglass trapeze to support the chain weight (which I believe is necessary anyway) as the bulkhead itself cannot support 50 or so meters of 8mm chain weight in rough weather.






Original height of anchor locker; no rear chain support.
Image

New anchor locker, with fiberglass addition in height, so as to support the chain's weight.
Image

New bulkhead. Yours will have to go all the way down to the bed surface to cover the head's loop which will be sandwitched between the two.
Image


Good luck !
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
Yannis
Senior Member
Posts: 3002
Joined: Oct 23rd, '13, 09:41
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by Yannis »

New anchor drain:



Image
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
matlos
Posts: 14
Joined: Jan 25th, '16, 08:15

Re: Over-flowing Head Problem....

Post by matlos »

Sounds like a solution... Do you reckon both pipes (inlet and outlet) need to have a loop, or just the inlet and a flapper valve on the outlet?
B31 SF 1963 Greece
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 311 guests